FBS Realignment ?
by talonk on Dec 15, 2009 5:40 PM EST
17 comments
With the announcement that the Big 10/11 will be looking to expand to 12 teams, just how will this affect the rest of the FBS landscape?
The easiest solution for all of FBS is if Notre Dame joins. This would not affect any currrent football situations, but would force the Big East to look for a 16th member for basketball becasue I can't see the Big 10 agreeing to Notre Dame joining for football only.
Other likely scenarios:
1. Missouri - With Mizzou seceding from the Big 12, I suspect that Arkansas jumps at the chance to re-establish a connection with the Texas schools. This would force the SEC to siphon another team from somewhere, and that most likely would be the ACC. If I had to guess, it might be Miami, but I don't think it would be any of the original 10 ACC schools. This would in turn force the ACC to raid the Big East, nabbing South Florida or Louisville. Or the SEC could bypass the ACC and try and scoop up West Virginia. This would leave the Big East scrambling to invite an 8th team. Hilariously, it might be forced to take Temple back. (Does anyone know if the Big East drops to 7 teams, would they lose their BCS distinction? - This would benefit the MWC greatly)
2. Pitt - The second most likely team overall, it would cause less movement because the Big 12, SEC, and ACC would be left intact. But the Big East would need to pull in an 8th team. Or would they go for 2-3 teams to make a 9 or 10 team conference?
3. Nebraska, Iowa St - same as Missouri.
4. Other Big East teams such as Rutgers, Syracuse - same as Pitt.
5. Teams that would not qualify academically: West Virginia, Cincinnati, Kentucky, Louisville.
Other options if Missouri move into the Big 10, would be for the Big 12 to pull in TCU, Houston or even Utah.
If one thing happens out of this, is that I hope the MAC drops back down to 12 teams or less, the Big East expands to at least 9 teams. I could even see C-USA getting cannabilized somewhat with East Carolina being gobbled up.
Thoughts?
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Nice Thread!
Here is a link to the story.
The story appears to be leaning towards Missouri, which you hashed out very well. I think TCU has to be considered as an alternative for the Big 12 to replace Missouri, as Arkansas has expressed contentment with the ACC.
According to Iowa Athletic Director Gary Barta an expansion would need to be a match in academics, athletics, philosophy and finance.
West Virginia brings a better product from the Big East in football and a similar commitment to sports. Academically they are respectable if not excellent. Without West Virginia how does the Big East look financially?
As for your question regarding how this would alter the automatic qualifications, the Big East will next be evaluated before 2014, if the current system is extended past the current contracts. A weakening of the Big East would not aid the MWC.
Losing TCU or Utah would hurt the MWC, and losing them next year could seriously weaken the MWC’s automatic qualification hopes for 2012 and 2013. This is the primary reason the MWC needs to expand now.
I will agree with Stewart Mandel on this one.
I’ll believe it when I see it.
I will be examining conference alignments more this off season.
BCS Evolution -- Punctuating the Equilibrium - twitter
by utesfan100 on Dec 15, 2009 8:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sorry about the link, page kept freezing fro me when I tried to link it earlier.
Arkansas has been rumbling about being a lesser team in the SEC (they are at best the 5th or 6th option behind Florida, Alabama, LSU, Georgia and probably Tennessee). If they re-entered the Big 12, they would be on the same level as Texas Tech and Oklahoma St, basically around the 3rd team behing Oklahoma and Texas.
As for West Virginia, they are not on a par academically. Please see the Crimson Quarry post on this. In that post, you will see they are a Tier 3 school academically while all Big 10 schools are Tier 1. I think that kills their chances even though they probably have the best duo of football and basketball of all the teams being currently mentioned.
by talonk on Dec 15, 2009 11:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If the Big Ten takes a member of the Big East
I wouldn’t be surprised if th eBig East went to 10 members. My top three to get to ten if a member of the Big East goes to the Big eleven Ten takes a team would be East Carolina, Central Florida, Notre Dame, but if they still want to be an indie then I would say Louisana Tech but I doubt that will happen or maybe Central Michigan but 10 could be hard to scrape up
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 15, 2009 11:38 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
or we could have Villinova and Georgetown move up to 1-A or FBS status and add a team
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 15, 2009 11:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Georgetown’s program is pretty awful right now. I could see on of the Colonial schools making the jump to FBS, but I severely doubt any of them would jump straight to a BCS conference. I think they would have to move to the C-USA, MAC, or Sun Belt first.
by talonk on Dec 15, 2009 11:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It would be like UConn they didn't just jump into the Big East we let them transistion
They didn’t just jump into the Big East there was a period where they were and independent I believe so it wouldn’t just be throw them into the fire right away
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 16, 2009 12:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Big East
if they had 3 FCS hoop members they could lose BCS status
by Jeremy Mauss on Dec 17, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I doubt Central Michigan leaves the MAC. In fact almost any of the Ohio/Michigan schools in the MAC probably would stay put.
I could see Marshall (from the C-USA) as they are very close geographically to West Virginia.
by talonk on Dec 15, 2009 11:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Marshall is terrible so they would hurt the Big East
A Central Florida I can see maybe East Carolina but getting to ten it starts to become hard to find a school that is close and would be willing to move to the Big East. Kentucky whould be great to have but would they leave the SEC, A Virginia would be good school but whould they want to leave the ACC. It becomes hard to find a tenth team other than having Villinova move up or Georgetown at some point
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 16, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just to be clear, you think an 0-12 FCS Georgetown would be better than a 6-6 FBS Marshall school, that actually had some history to it? I know Marshall might be a tough fit in regards to basketball, so you would have a point there.
by talonk on Dec 16, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't know Georgetown was that bad at football
So lets go Central Florida, East Carolina and Villinova and call it a day
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 16, 2009 1:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh, and don’t forget, whichever schools transfer in would count towards the BCS records etc, which might afect the Big East’s automatic BCS bid.
by talonk on Dec 16, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ok go with 9 teams until after the BCS stuff gets settled and then bring up 'Nova
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Chris Carter and Kevin Greene
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 16, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Missouri makes absolutely no sense for the Big Ten
I don’t understand why Missouri keeps coming up. They would be the worst academic institution in the conference. They wouldn’t bring much of a fan base or tradition (not that it is terrible, but if the Big 10 is going to expand it doesn’t do anything for them). It just doesn’t make sense. Here are my suggestions (also posted this over Rivalry Esq):
Aim high.
1) Notre Dame – Biggest brand and biggest opportunity for the conference. I think we all agree here.
2) Texas – A reach? Yes. But aim high, remember. They fit in with the other Big 10 schools in terms of tradition, size, AND academics. They may arguably be more financially beneficial to the Big 10 than Notre Dame. They make more money on their athletics than any other school in the country and it isn’t even close. As far as academics, I believe it would be a step up (over staying in the Big XII), but I’m not sure the Big Ten would impact them at all financially. But can you imagine some of the regular season games? OSU/Texas, PSU/Texas, etc. Huge. I think the one thing that dooms this is weather. Why would Texas want to play regular games in Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Happy Valley with potential for severe winter weather. I agree it doesn’t get too terrible before December 1, but it still can snow. Texas would be at a huge disadvantage in these games.
3) Rutgers – The more I think about this one, the more it makes sense for everyone involved. More money for Rutgers because Big Ten > Big East, more money for the Big Ten because of eyeballs on the TV. I do realize that the Northeast is far more concerned about pro sports, but it is still such a large market that it is impossible to ignore.
4) Pitt – I think this makes sense for all the same reasons as Rutgers, but with a smaller (but not small) TV market. The academics are up to snuff much like Rutgers as well.
5) Nebraska – A rabid following deep rooted in tradition and located in the Midwest. I’m not sure the academics are what the conference is looking for in a member.
6) Missouri – I don’t get why the Big 10 would want them. What does it do for the Big 10? The academics aren’t there. The tradition and fan base don’t seem to be there. This one just doesn’t make sense other than geography.
Going in this order, I would think Rutgers is the most likely choice because it is mutually beneficial to both sides more than any other school.
by rencito on Dec 16, 2009 3:44 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I do believe Rutgers is a strong option, but for some reason, I sense the KC market is another valuable market the Big 10 can exploit. It is not NY of course, but I really don’t think Rutgers would add a lot to the Big 10, just because it is in NJ. The television market in KC is currently untapped by the Big 10 and is relatively on the larger side. Yes Rutgers would give the Big 10 some foothold in the NY market, but as has been stated elsewhere, NY really only follows the Jets/Giants, and could care less about Rutgers football (check their attendance and facilitites).
From what I have read, the Big 10 does want a name school and/or market, so Texas would be an awesome pick up, I just don’t see that as being feasible. Missouri has a better tradition in sports than Rutgers, and while its academics is on the lower side, they are not that far off from the lower end Big 10 schools. Nebraska’s market is nothing to speak of, and Pitt’s market is already covered by Penn St.
If the Big 10 goes towards New York, I believe they pursue Syracuse, not Rutgers. Syracuse has a rich tradition in a lot of sports, and while it is not actually in NY city proper, there are plenty of Syracuse alumni in the city.
Just my opinions.
by talonk on Dec 16, 2009 7:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If it is Missouri
I do not think Arkansas would be the choice or TCU, because that means a huge imbalance in the North/South. I doubt either Oklahoma school or the new one would go to the north. Look for it to be BYU or Utah, probably BYU because the Big XII wanted them back in 1996 when the SWC folded.
by Jeremy Mauss on Dec 17, 2009 2:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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